For a long time, I didn’t really self identify as a feminist. You could even say that I was a bit wishy-washy on the whole subject, and you wouldn’t be wrong. I thought I was lucky because sexism had never really affected me or my life.
Unfortunately, I wasn’t actually lucky. I was just naive.
I completely bought into the “good girl” thing that Justine was talking about in her article:
“Raising a girl to be ‘nice’,” a therapist – a woman in her sixties, married and with daughters — once remarked to me, “is like sending her out into the world with one hand tied behind her back.””
That nice girl is me. Was me, is perhaps more accurate. Sexism has affected me my entire life, sometimes in profound ways. Our society’s ideas about gender roles have played a role in shaping who I am, whether I like to admit it or not.
I don’t hate men. Actually, I really like men. Some of my very best friends have been and still are men. There have been times in my life when pretty much all my friends have been male. I have also been friends with guys who are obviously sexist. (Unfortunately, the more overtly sexist, the less likely the friendship will last, because ultimately it’s kind of hard to maintain a friendship with someone who is treating you poorly. Wish I had learned this one a lot sooner.) So I guess I’m the kind of feminist who doesn’t hate men and is only occasionally angry? Oh, and thinks being a housewife is a perfectly fine life choice, thank you very much.
I find the idea that I’d be better off finding a win-win situation in the workplace a bit shallow at best, though. I mean, it sounds great in theory, but what if I work in an industry in which I’m going to face discrimination for being a woman regardless of the company or my boss? I was talking to a female engineer the other day, and she told this story that really appalled me about her male co-workers’ behavior. When I told her that I didn’t know if I’d want to deal with that in my workplace, she responded that her company is actually pretty good to its female engineers. And I believe her; it might very well be worse elsewhere. That doesn’t mean that better is particularly great though. But she has to put up with it if she wants to continue being an engineer, and doing it with good grace is preferable for her career prospects.
As a writer dealing with sexism, it really matters what sub-field I’m in. The kidlit community seems to be made up of about 90% women. I have never experienced any noticeable sexism or inappropriate behavior in the kidlit community. Because I, as previously stated, like men, I’ve hung out with many of the men in the community, and they have always been respectful and treated me like any colleague.
The science fiction/fantasy community, on the other hand, is made up of about 40% women. On the plus side, women writers in the field also win about 40% of the major awards, which is great. Unfortunately, I am sometimes treated differently in the community because of my gender. I have heard about sexual harassment problems at conventions, and I have no trouble whatsoever believing them based on my own experiences. And because I am the “nice girl,” more often than not I let it slide. I push through my discomfort and keep right on smiling. This is the current reality of being a female speculative writer (or at least a relatively young and cute one). So should I stop writing science fiction and fantasy and find a more women-friendly environment in another genre? Or just not be part of the community? You have got to be kidding me. That’s not a win-win. It’s a big fat lose if I feel forced to leave a genre that I love.
Like it or not, sexism is a reality most women are forced to deal with (if you haven’t, I’m happy for you, but I also don’t really believe it). Some of us may not recognize that it’s happening. I often don’t recognize it’s happening. I’ve been watching movies all my life, and it’s only recently that I began to notice how gender is so often portrayed in Hollywood. Now that I’m breaking away from being “too nice” or the “good girl,” I find it valuable to try to notice. Sometimes there might be nothing I can do; sometimes I might have to stand there and smile. Sometimes someone might assume that I’m a man-hating hormonal nightmare of a woman if I use the word “feminist” or a bitch if I don’t temporize, soften my opinions, or stay quiet. But if I notice, at least I can make my own decision about how to respond and have a greater understanding of what’s going on around me and how society is encouraging me to have certain behavior patterns.
For me, feminism is not about fighting against men. It’s about fighting against stereotypes and preconceived boxes that are too small to fit who I am. It’s about being able to be taken seriously in the avocation of my choice, whether that be composer or teacher, science fiction or romance writer, engineer or housewife. It’s about taking a stand against having to fit into the definition of “good girl,” a definition I had no part in creating.
Okay, have at it. Is there anything I missed? Do you consider yourself to be a feminist? Why or why not?
The Practical Free Spirit 
I love your thoughtful post on this topic. Over the years, I’ve witnessed many changes yet some things remain. It’s especially interesting when looking at writing, and especially genres as you talk about within your post. Gender isn’t the only identity construction we have to deal with, as writers or even with our very own characters.
Very good point. There are many identity constructions, most of them (maybe even all?) challenging in their own ways.
What an interesting post. I don’t generally consider myself a feminist, but that’s mostly because I’m not very active/an activist. I get all riled up in my office or my friend circle about mistreatment of women, but I don’t DO a lot about it. That’s probably a bad thing. On the other hand, I worked for a home-based business where we have a niche market and don’t need to do a lot of marketing. I’m pretty positive the fact that we’re women is completely irrelevant next to 20 years of experience in the province. That tends to trump.
In the writing world, I started in FanFiction, which is predominantly populated by women. I’ve read a mix of male and female writers. The balance probably tips slightly in favour of woemn, though the split is pretty equal as I think about. My two favourites are Robert Jordan and Tamora Pierce, for instance. My publisher is headed by a pair of women. Would I have gone with a male publisher or agent? Hell yes! Am I feeling under-represented because my publisher is a woman? Hell no!
I expect the ‘sexism’ as I delve into the fantasy/sci-fi genre will start to emerge the longer and further I immerse myself in it. For now though, I can’t say I’ve seen a lot of it.
Oh, interesting point, a beta suggested that I make my MC female thinking that I’d gone with a male because that was ‘standard’ in fantasy lit. I hadn’t thought about that before, but realize she is right. My first novel MC is female, though a male plays prominently. My second is seen through three MCs: two female, one male. And the third is narrated by a male character, but the plot is driven by the female ghost haunting him. I think I’m straddling nicely. This fence might start to get uncomfortable if I sit here long, though. 🙂
In writing it’s really difficult because our own biases will so often shine through. In a way this can be good for sharing different worldviews, but sometimes it can be embarrassing and/or detrimental to the story. And so much of it can be subconscious!
I’m not an activist myself either. I’ve decided (right this minute) that I can stand for equal rights for women without doing lots of typical activism work.
I’m a feminist because I believe in equal rights between women and men, and though I am relatively insulated through chance, I live in a largely misogynistic world. In many countries females are brutalized simply for being female.
From dictionary.com: Feminism- “the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.”
Nowhere in the definition of “feminism” is “man-hating” mentioned.
Thanks for a great post. 🙂
I sometimes forget that there even exists a “man-hating feminist” stereotype, but I think it’s very unfortunate. Thanks very much for the definition.
I was talking to a friend the other day about the “missing girls” of China: the girl fetuses that have been aborted because of their sex.
You’re welcome. It’s unfortunate that the definition of “feminism” is misunderstood by so many. The definition has been hijacked (femi-nazi, etc) by anti-feminists, but I’m not going to let those who think less of females define my words for me.
China is one of many examples of femicide around the world. In Saudi Arabia and Iran you have Sharia Law. In Latin America you have epidemic female rape and femicide. In many parts of Africa, women and girls are singled out for rape, torture, and mutilation in war zones. The list goes on. All this information is readily available with a simple Google search. Misogyny is a worldwide epidemic, and pretending is doesn’t exist isn’t going to make it go away.
Interesting post! I’m a people pleaser, not as in I need to please people to like me but growing up I found myself often in a parental role which left me w/the sense of being needed. If I’m not needed, then what good am I? That’s how I see myself & behave towards people. I’m not a feminist. It would not be wrong for me to assume most feminists would hate me. As a woman, in a work field supposedly dominated by men (yet my coworkers are mainly women ’cause my company was smart in it’s hiring techniques) I do there what I do everywhere in society; I remove my gender. I’m a woman. So what? IF I didn’t’ have the skills I had, hiring me to fill a minority quota would end up being pointless. Being more lenient because I tend to my house & family more than my partner does would not encourage me to stay w/ a company. I took up the position of a pacifist & a true equal opportunity individual in life. Everyone is equal. Man or woman, we have equal responsibilities & equal rights & that is how I see life. When a woman says to me “women are treated less because..” I ask, what is the situation? Is she actually fit for what the job requires or is she demanding for special treatment? Does she see herself as lesser & there for more needy because of her gender? Is she using her gender as an excuse to adjust the rules & bend them more in her favor? I think far too many women fall back on the belief that we are still a society that treats women as minority. Are we? Really? Or are people selfish ego driven individuals who believe society must bend for them because of their idea of a greater good. Life isn’t fair, period. Only we can decide how to navigate through it & when we say we believe in equality perhaps we should consider what that word really means because it takes countless selfless acts & the removal of one’s own selfish needs to see what’s truly needed for a greater good. There is a quote I use often to remind myself of this: The needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many & what I sometimes have to realize is that my needs is little & insignificant compared to the needs of so many others. My gender has never stopped me. I have been discriminated against by far more than just it & my response has always been the same, continue pursuing what I’m doing, never see myself as less & never let the road blocks stop me. People can think what they want of me but unless they literally shackle me to a wall they wont stop me & they may even be impressed by the fact that I see myself equal to them & never once use my gender as an excuse or reason why. Who I am as an individual is just enough. Being female is just a bonus ;).
Of course no issue is black and white. But what I want for myself isn’t what I’d consider special treatment. I don’t want people to cut me breaks because I’m a woman or accept sub-standard work because I’m a woman. I take the quality of whatever I’m doing very seriously. I also don’t think my gender is a reason why I succeed or don’t succeed, but it does change the way people interact with me in certain settings.
As for the greater good, I’d like a world in which all the female teens I’ve worked with won’t have to be harrassed because they’re female, where they won’t live with the cultural expectation to be “nice” in a way that holds them back, and where they’ll have the same opportunities as the male teens I’ve worked with. I believe that this world would be for the greater good.
I do not, and will never describe myself as a feminist, if not least because I aknowledge that men also lose by gender stereotyping, perhaps not in the same ways, perhaps in ways that are less obvious, or considered less important, but they do. I would like to see a world where everyone is free to be the person they wish to be, reguardless of gender. To embrace a term that willfully ignores half the population, even if it promotes the half that currently has fewer rights seems to me self-defeating.
Just out of curiosity, how does “the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men” willfully ignore half the population? 🙂
The doctrine may at least theoretically be inclusive, although there is a definite stress on women in that wording (women equal to men vs men equal to women or men and women being equal) but the word does not. The word feminism comes from feminine which isn’t a word applied equally to men and women at all. It may sound silly to quibble over a word, but words are how we communicate, I happen to think it’s important. If you can suggest a term that more clearly implies equality I’d be happy to stand behind that, but I can’t really think of one, equalism kind of sounds silly.
“Feminism,” “Equalism,” “Gender Equality”- I don’t care as long as equality is the doctrine. 🙂
When someone comes up with another term, I’m sure that term will be hijacked as well.
Gender stereotyping can be harmful to everyone involved, I definitely agree with that.
However, I do wonder if by advocating greater acceptance of typically “feminine” traits, we might also improve the lot of men who suffer due to gender stereotyping? Just a thought.
I’m not sure that feminism ignores the existence of men. It seems that the stereotype of “man hating” feminists means that, like it or not, feminists are still being defined in some way by their relationship to men. I agree that the term can be divisive, but I do wonder how much of that is about trying to obfuscate the greater issues about gender equality (or lack thereof) that are being raised. But I’d be open to a discussion on what else could be done about improving the current gender bias, whether it be a “feminist” discussion or not.
Feminism absolutely takes men into consideration- it’s the starting point of the definition of “feminism.” The rights of men are viewed as the “gold standard,” and feminists- both female AND male feminists- aspire to have the rights of women match the rights of men. So there’s no way to separate the genders in the doctrine of feminism. The definition of the rights of one depend on the definition of the rights of the other. Feminism will only be irrelevant when women’s and men’s rights are equal to each other.
Let me be the first man to reply (I think) and say WOW! Great post! Now go mop the floor.
I AM SO KIDDING!
I met you online prior to Taos and felt that you were a fantastic person with a writing ability that is head and shoulders above the rest. Yes, I noticed that you were female the very MOMENT that I met you in person. That was a good thing. Being the opposite gender from you, I too have had many female friends and there are times when ALL my friends have been female. I prefer the company of women to that of men for reasons I won’t go into here, but none of them are sexual. It’s a compatibility thing, an emotional resonance. Guys tend to fart loudly and then look at you expectantly while giggling. As if they expect me to rate their farts. Or something. Whatever. I’m probably stereotyping.
I cannot help, at this point in my life, my gender identification. I am a white, straight male who tends to have slightly antiquated views of women. I hold doors. I say “ma’am” on occasion. I was raised to be, mostly, a Southern gentleman but there is a mischievous streak in me that tends to lean in the direction of “ornery”.
Do I, personally, think less of you for writing in a male-dominated genre? Hell no. You’re a great writer and I enjoy your prose. Do I care that you are a female? Nope. I think it gives you a leg up, figuratively, over the other writers who are non-female (insert fart reference here).
You are a winsome, intelligent, funny, insightful woman and I’m proud to know ya. I look forward to whatever you send my way, writing-wise, and I will eviscerate you if you misuse commas and dangle your participles. It has nothing to do with your gender.
Thanks, again, for such an insightful piece.
Lou
Thanks, Lou!
I do not personally mind doors held open and other such things. I do think it’s rude if someone expresses that such behaviors make her uncomfortable and said behavior persists (unless there’s some really important reason WHY it persists). But happily, since I don’t mind, I don’t have to deal with such rudeness myself. 🙂
Also you just showered me with compliments. Nom nom nom compliments. Thanks again!
Ugh, you remind me of my friend, who when I was barbequeing in the summer before my daughter’s birth informed that I was barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen. 😉 You just HAD to, didn’t you?
I think chivalry is not dead, but a woman can be just as chirvalrous to a man. I’ll hold the door for a man. Women who are infuriated by courtesy confuse me. They aren’t saying you can’t open the door yourself, they’re saying, I’m here and I can do this for you. Just as you would to any other human being.
Okay, enough of that. I have to push my daughter off to bed. She likes when we open the door for her, too. 😉
Kimmy,
I agree with your perspective. My opening a door for a woman isn’t intended by me to be a sneering insult to the woman in question that she is incapable, or weak, or even needs the damned door to be opened for her. I was raised in a time and place where general courtesies were performed as a matter of course, and the recipient need not be gender-specific. One says “please” and “thank you” because it is a nicety. Not because we expect to rub others’ noses in the dirt for NOT saying “please” and “thank you”
Similarly, I was taught to address my elders by their last names, regardless of gender, even when they said “Oh, just call me Bob.” The correct reply was always “Yes sir, Mr. Jones.” Even if his name wasn’t Jones. I kid.
Finally, I was taught to open doors for women. While the etiology of such behavior may have been to underscore that the “fairer sex” was “prone to vapors” and needed all the manly help that could be mustered, it seems to me that the actions in question truly do provide a sort of gender-worship to the women involved. How is that a bad thing? If you examine the societal makeup of the South, I believe that careful examination will reveal that what appears to be, on the surface, a patriarchal society is, in fact, more matriarchal.
Women, as a rule, tend to be placed on slight pedestals most of the time. Fold into that fact that my sexual orientation and gender bias (mentioned earlier, where I prefer the company of women) and you will see that, for me at least, gender is a rather clearcut thing for me. i loves women. Just loves them. And I will try to be resourceful and helpful and respectful as often as required.
Kimmy, if you want to hold the door for me, I will incline my head and thank you for the small courtesy. It will never enter my mind that you meant to insult me or imply that I couldn’t open a door on my own. Doing so for me would generate nothing but warm fuzzy feelings.
Lou, I would really love to have a conversation with you about your Southern upbringing and the societal makeup of the South. So expect me to corner you at Worldcon!
I think our society needs to learn to scorn “bad boys” as much as we scorn “bad girls”. That Paris Hilton is a pathetic fucked up individual who should not be admired, but Charlie Sheen’s bizarre antics are not admirable either. That the entire cast of Jersey Shore are repulsive scumbags, not just Snooki.
Yeah, I agree. I can’t believe that Charlie Sheen doesn’t face the same censor that Paris Hilton or Brittany Spears face, but it is highly annoying.
I’m 57 years old and I’m bummed out that we’re still talking about it. Not that much has changed. Oh, sure. Nobody thinks women should be barred from being policemen or firemen. And we’ve had a few female Secretaries of State. That was nice.
But the pay differential is the same as in the 70s when this all started happening – a woman still makes in the neighborhood of about 75 cents to a man’s dollar for same work and same quals.
The only thing that HAS changed in 40 years is that somehow, even nice people think that feminism has some association with man-hating. That’s about as weird as anything could have gotten. What a disappointment. Ah, well.
PS You can be a feminist without DOING anything. I’m quite the optimist but don’t carry signs or march.
Thanks for the PS. That is how I feel too. I’m writing about feminism a little bit and pointing things out occasionally, but I’m not much for the marching. Honestly, I still have a lot of practice to do to even notice what’s going on around me.
I do think things have changed to the point where it has become easier to ignore the prejudice. This is good in some ways (not such egregious sexism), but bad in others as it is a lot easier to sweep issues under the rug.
No, Amy, don’t ignore it. You don’t have to react to it, but to ignore it is to allow it. Resist it gently if you can and loudly if you must, if for no other reason than to hope that you’re not sending this comment to a blogger when YOU are 57.
I’m going to read Mika Brzezinski’s book Knowing Your Value, in which she talks about getting – excuse me – royally screwed salarywise by management, and she’s young, connected, beautiful, smart, and has an internationally renowned and very intimidating daddy! So it is still very much UNCHANGED, in the area that most matters: money (area that matters second: corporate America still doesn’t respect that one gender is still responsible for popping out the next generation of workers).
Okay, stick a fork in me.
Oh, I’m not saying that *I* am going to ignore it, just that in general it seems easier for people to ignore and/or dismiss. Like women’s lib is something that happened and now is over, that the problem is solved, when I think we still need to be talking about issues and striving to do better. As you say, the problem is not solved. But it does look different.
Yes, I’m absolutely a feminist. I have been since I was a little kid, when I started noticing that there were different expectations for boys and girls. That people would assume they knew who you were and what you liked based on your sex. That almost all of the shows and movies I liked to watch were segregated into those aimed at girls and those aimed at boys, and most of the fun ones were aimed at boys, with few female characters and fewer still who had personalities. And as I’ve grown up, I’ve seen more of how sexism plays out in real life. That people still have different expectations for boys and girls, men and women, still make assumptions based on your sex. I’ve watched people put up with things they know aren’t right, so they can keep their job, their boyfriend, or husband, because they look around at what everyone else is doing and think that’s just the way it has to be. I’ve seen smart women let themselves be taken advantage of, because that’s what’s happening to their friends so it must be normal, and I’ve seen good men take advantage without meaning to because they just do what their friends are doing without stopping to think if it’s fair or right.
I think that being a woman is like being a minority in some ways, but that it’s a little more insidious. If you’re an ethnic minority, you can try to minimize the impacts the oppressive majority have on your daily life by moving to a neighborhood that is mostly the same ethnicity as you, choose friends of the same ethnicity, marry someone from the same ethnicity, participate more in your ethnicity’s culture than in the mainstream. Not that that’s necessarily a win if you’re isolated, but if you’re a hetero woman, and you’re not ready to swear lifelong celibacy, then the battle for equality follows you home into your bedroom everyday. Hopefully you can obviate most of the problem by choosing a partner who’s smart and respectful, but there are still the little ongoing battles to be taken seriously and treated fairly. This is where the “good girl” thing comes in. You get tired of being called “difficult” or “crazy,” or you begin to believe you really are, just because you know what you want and you ask for it firmly. You just want to be the nice girlfriend/wife again and have everything be happy and go smoothly. It’s no wonder many women get tired and cede so many little victories, inadvertently teaching their daughters and sons that ongoing imbalance in one spouse’s favor is normal and OK.
(I’m not even going into the big, obvious stuff, like glass ceilings and representation among elected officials and such.)
Do I hate men? Absolutely not. Most of my friends are men. They are wonderful, intelligent, sensitive, unique people and I love them. There are men out there who contribute to sexism, but aside from a few wacko misogynists I think mostly they’re just people who need some perspective. Do I disapprove of housewives? Absolutely not. I think the whole point of feminism is to defend every woman’s right to define herself, rather than letting others define how a woman should be.
Mer, you are one of my feminist role models.
I don’t know how I feel about comparing being a woman to being a racial minority. Although the issues have certain similarities, it feels a bit too much like problem comparing to make me comfortable. (Also, honestly, having to completely isolate yourself from other ethnicities and lose many opportunities as a result (not to mention the financial ramifications) sounds pretty bad to me.)
That being said, I do like your point about the battle for equality following women into the home. I’ve read more than one study that says that even when both parents work, and even though men are more involved in child rearing than in the past, the mom still does the lion’s share of the work. This is not encouraging, and it’s something I worry about for myself.
I always used to get the “emotional” label, myself. 🙂
Also that last sentence is dynamo. Thank you so much for commenting.
Role model?? *blushes*
Yes, I don’t want to imply that having to retreat to certain communities instead of being able to live wherever/however you like is good. And I agree that comparing the difficulties for women and the difficulties for ethnic minorities is awkward, to say the least. It could wander into “who’s had it worse?” territory, which trivializes suffering. But let us never forget that there have been similarities. Both groups have been bought and sold, denied the vote, denied the right to own property, denied the right to enter their chosen profession, judged by “scientists” of the day to be inherently mentally inferior, etc. etc. etc. And these struggles have played out in different ways. The man who owned a woman, who was legally allowed to physically abuse her, who owned her property, who voted against her having the right to vote–that man was not an unrelated stranger, but her own husband or father, someone who professed to love her, and to esteem her sex in general. It’s not that that’s worse than anyone else’s sufferings have been. Just that it was real, and it was wrong. It is its own struggle, with its own rules. Those old wrongs leave their mark on our current society, but because they were so Janus-faced to begin with, they’re even more insidious now. How many men (and women) are still saying one thing about women with their words, but saying something completely different with their actions? (Totally not directed at Lou; I’m a big fan of politeness for both sexes.)
“That people would assume they knew who you were and what you liked based on your sex.”
I’d say there’s a big difference between assuming a girl will wear pink dresses while a boy will not and paying a woman less than a man doing the same job because she’s a woman. The latter is always sexism. The former is just a stereotype – a statistically reasonable assumption until evidence is shown in the contrary on that particular individual. It becomes sexism when the girl must wear a pink dress because she’s a girl.
How about when the only clothes available for the little girl are pink dresses? I was talking to a friend with a girl baby who was saying it was fairly difficult for her to find clothes that weren’t overtly gendered.
“I’d say there’s a big difference between assuming a girl will wear pink dresses while a boy will not and paying a woman less than a man doing the same job because she’s a woman. The latter is always sexism. The former is just a stereotype – a statistically reasonable assumption until evidence is shown in the contrary on that particular individual.” Is it still a harmless statistical assumption if one assumes that a girl will not like math, science, or sports, based on the number of girls who don’t like those things? I just think there’s a lot of gray area, and that gender assumptions can be problematic. Sometimes they’re harmless, sometimes they’re right, sometimes they have insidious consequences.
“I think the whole point of feminism is to defend every woman’s right to define herself, rather than letting others define how a woman should be.”
Amen, Meredith.
Great post! I was one who RT’ed Zoe’s post, not because I agreed with everything she stated, but because she made me think. I like thinking. 🙂
Like you, I’ve had many male friends throughout my life, and “man-hater” would never apply to me. However, no matter how much I agree with the goals of feminism, I don’t call myself one. This is more my aversion to calling myself anything. Especially if it has political connotations. I think I’m allergic to politics. 🙂
Instead, I live my life according to those goals, and everyone can either deal with me that way or get out of my way. In other words, I don’t *ask* for or *demand* equality – I simply *expect* it. For example, several years back, rather than complaining about my salary compared to men, I negotiated a raise before accepting the job offer.
The hiring manager later told me that I was the ONLY woman to ever negotiate their job offer, yet virtually every man had done so, asking for a higher starting salary, more vacation time, a hiring bonus, etc. Something. How much of the salary discrepancy is because woman are too much people-pleasers to ever think of expecting more? The fault there doesn’t lie with the hiring company but with women’s reluctance to see themselves as “worth it.”
I’d like to think things have improved with how we’re raising our daughters, but then I see doll’ed-up girls dating guys who look like they barely bothered to find clothes that weren’t in the dirty clothes hamper. *sigh* I want to shake those girls and tell them not to put up with that kind of disrespect. I want them to stand up for themselves and say, “If you want to date me, you’re going to have to make me proud to be seen with you.” They need to see themselves as worth the effort from the boys.
Did I rant? Why, yes, I do believe I did. 🙂
Oh, I’m glad I read Zoe’s post; it got me thinking too. 🙂
Thanks for bringing up the negotiation thing. I’m reminded of a TED talk given by Sheryl Sandberg (COO of Facebook), in which she brings up similar issues: http://www.ted.com/talks/sheryl_sandberg_why_we_have_too_few_women_leaders.html
Also, major kudos to you for valuing yourself appropriately! I find that very inspiring to hear, although sad that you were the only one to do so at that company.
I agree that the way we raise our daughters is key, but it’s tough, both because they will be bombarded with negative messages from the outside world, and because it seems like it would be easy to slip up in parenting since we’ve been receiving those same messages ourselves. But it is definitely something to strive hard for!
I’m a feminist. I’m a believer that anything that men can do, women can do also… except give birth and other obvious anatomical functions. 🙂
Hooray! I look forward to the day when we have a woman President … and even more to the day when having a woman President isn’t considered to be a big deal.
I could have written most all of Jessica Good’s post. From the peacemaker/caretaker role at home, to working in a mostly male environment (police depts and courts) for years, I have never wanted different/special/preferential treatment because I’m a woman and in fact have refused same. We’re all human beings, some just less skilled than others and still falling back on outdated modes of thinking.
Claiming the victim mantle because of gender (or race, or age, et al) helps no one. Until we get past the labels, whatever they may be, someone will feel left out or insulted. And the only way to get past them is to rise above them. The brutality in other countries is horrific and while we can speak out in support, only education of the upcoming generation can change anything.
As another post said, life isn’t fair. Get over it. Live your life, your way, and stop looking for ways to claim you’ve been oppressed/denied/overlooked. We all have been, in one way or another.
I don’t think just because I identify as a feminist means that I think I’m a victim. Well, in any case, I *don’t* think of myself as a victim, so there you go. As for getting over it, it’s not like I’m lying in a crumpled heap on the floor gnashing my teeth and wailing about how unfair everything is.
However, as you say, speaking out in support, raising awareness, and providing education are all ways to help change and improve the world around us. And I, for one, think it will be a better world when a female writer can attend a convention to further her career and not have to worry about being sexually harassed. I think it will be a better world if there are more movies that show female characters who talk to each other about things other than men. And I think it will be a better world if there are less social pressures around women being “nice” and, for example, not feeling comfortable negotiating for a better salary at work even when that’s what *all* the men there are doing.
Now, I’m sure some people would disagree that my examples above would make for a better world, or say that I should just get over it. But if I do get over it, and all other people get over it, then we’ve just lost any chance of making a change. There’s nothing wrong with striving to uphold and disseminate one’s ideals. There’s nothing wrong with sharing one’s experiences. There’s nothing wrong with saying, hey, maybe we could do better than this. I’m gathering that this isn’t what feminism means to some (or maybe even a lot) of people. But it’s what it means to me.
You keep mentioning being sexually harassed at a convention.
Where is this convention and how can I sign up?
I wander through the halls of the conventions I go to and notice, with a forlorn expression, that nobody is sexually harassing ME!! I mean, gosh!!
Seriously, though, unwanted sexual advances have no place at a convention. Period. They belong at the after-parties and the bars. Come on, people. Let’s focus on what’s right and what’s wrong!
There are many of my female colleagues who have spoken up about being harassed at conventions, often by men who are in perceived or actual positions of power (aka agents and editors). It is a problem our community is attempting to deal with, but honestly I don’t know how well that’s going. At least discussion about it is occasionally taking place, and that’s a step in the right direction.
I love your post Amy! Wish I had more time read more of your blog. I do carry feminism at the forefront of my life because we are all affected by society’s gender role expectations. Ever since working at a domestic violence shelter, I can’t deny the painful truth that misogyny is alive and well.
I talked a lot about feminism in college, but over the years have used the word less frequently. I remember taking a Feminist Theory course where we talked about the purpose of feminism…..is…..to put itself out of business – create a world in which we do not need feminism. Awareness about the issues you raise must be at the forefront of our lives in order to have that.
And….now that I have a daughter, I’ve been thinking about all of these things much more – the way women are portrayed in the media, access to family planning resources, the pursuit of the “thin ideal,” how women make less money on average than men…….I could go on and on.
Would love to hear your thoughts on a book called Female Chauvinist Pigs by Ariel Levy.
I’m sure that if I ever have a daughter, it will change my perceptions as well.
I’m not sure if I’ve read that book, although it sounds interesting.
I like what you say about the purpose of feminism is that there doesn’t need to be feminism anymore. Don’t think we’re there yet, but it’s nice to think that maybe someday we might be.
Good for you for writing up, Amy Sundberg!
Thank you, Amy Fonarow!
[…] of the case), I’ve been thinking a lot about sexual harassment. I’ve written about it a bit before, and I want to call up one of the comments that old post received, from […]